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Astrophel
Fear will kill your mind and steal your love as sure as anything;
Fear will rob you blind and make you numb to others suffering









Since: 10-03-04
From: Azul Lux Orbital, Kirin Beta

Since last post: 1074 days
Last activity: 422 days
Posted on 05-27-05 03:28 PM Link | Quote
When did Palpatine become evil? Did that happen in Episode 2?

If it did, I don't really want any further explanation, since I hope to see Ep. 2 sometime. I missed it because I was sick that day.
Xeoman

Ball and Chain Trooper
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Since: 08-14-04
From: 255

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 7 days
Posted on 05-27-05 03:33 PM Link | Quote
Uh, way before any of the Episodes.

Have you seen Episode III? He tells the story about his Master, Darth Plagues and hints at the fact that he killed him in his sleep.

Also, Sidious made several appearances in Episode I, and I surely hope you know ...

Sidious = Palpatine = The Emperor.
geeogree

Ninji








Since: 10-19-04

Since last post: 3769 days
Last activity: 1918 days
Posted on 05-27-05 05:54 PM Link | Quote
well, he didn't mean "Sith".... he did say Evil.... the sith aren't neccesarily evil.... just self-centered...

but, depending on what he means you are correct.... he trained as a Sith before these episodes occur
Katana

Dark Wizard
\"She said tonight...come on come on collide...see what I fire feels like..I bet its just like heaven.\"








Since: 08-15-04
From: Philadelphia, P.A.

Since last post: 149 days
Last activity: 125 days
Posted on 05-30-05 08:23 AM Link | Quote
Both are correct Tamarin. The Sith are only evil because what they want just sucks for everybody else. They don't think they're evil however. They just want and take what they want. Which is considered evil because...to sum it all up, like I said, what the sith want sucks for everybody else for the most part.

But yes, he was a sith even before Episode 1, and I think even for a sith, Palpatine was evil. I mean he was selfish and all, but nonetheless an intelligent character, so I think even he knew what he wanted was bad, he just didn't care. Gotta admire that ambition!
Xeoman

Ball and Chain Trooper
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Since: 08-14-04
From: 255

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 7 days
Posted on 05-30-05 10:21 AM Link | Quote
What strikes me is this ...

We all know the basis rule to the Sith, to become a Master, is to kil your Master. Like Sidiuos did with Plageous.

The thing is, The Emperor hints at Yoda when they both flipped to the door at the start of their fight "That Lord Vader will become more powerful than I have ever seen".

Doesn't that kind of suggest he'd want Vader to kill him? And become and even more powerful Sith?

Well, Vader never does. That's the thing. He even says to both Padme, and Luke in the Old Trilogy "Together we can overthrow the Emperor, and rule the galaxy". I was thinking about this yesterday, and just couldn't find an answer to why Vader would have never killed The Emperor, mainly from the time of III to IV.

I just kind of think Vader was either "sad" and or didn't care. If you really think about it, it just seems like Vader is pretty much in a state of depression from Episode III and onwards, until the very end of VI. So, in the end I just don't think he really had anything to gain, or didn't care to kill the Emperor himself even though he probably could have.
Katana

Dark Wizard
\"She said tonight...come on come on collide...see what I fire feels like..I bet its just like heaven.\"








Since: 08-15-04
From: Philadelphia, P.A.

Since last post: 149 days
Last activity: 125 days
Posted on 05-30-05 10:34 AM Link | Quote
Well...We all know that Vader always "had good in him still". Why didn't he kill the Emperor sooner? It's blantanly obvious the emotional attachment Anakin had for Palpatine. If you think about it, since Vader was still somewhat himself, even if just a smidge, then he was still emotionally attached to the Emperor. So that's why I don't think Vader killed him until the very end when he realized that everything about Palpatine truly was wrong and that he was hurting Luke.


(Last edited by Katana on 05-30-05 01:35 PM)
Xeoman

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Since: 08-14-04
From: 255

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 7 days
Posted on 05-30-05 10:36 AM Link | Quote
Meh, put it simply.
But yeah, that does sound right.

If I were Anakin though I would have easily turned agains't the Emperor in time. After all, it was basically Palpatine's fault for everything that happened to Anakin that was bad. Padme's death, him losing his body basically, etc.

Then again that's "me", not "the character".
Shinobi

Koopa








Since: 10-24-04
From: Kansas

Since last post: 5598 days
Last activity: 5215 days
Posted on 05-30-05 02:20 PM Link | Quote
I think perhaps he didn't kill the Emperor because he wanted to bring Padme back and he still couldn't let go of her death. Luke said to Vader that he could sense the struggle that is going on within him. Perhaps it is that he still has not accepted Padme's death and still wishes to bring her back?

Palpatine did say in Episode III that the Sith (if powerful enough) could keep people from dying. I guess rather or not if they could bring them back from the dead or not is still left unquestion. The Palpatine theory cold also be correct to. I also think he just had a deep bond with Padme and just couldn't let go of her.
Truth/Serum

Cheep-cheep
Continued Harassment.








Since: 03-07-05
From: In pieces

Since last post: 4878 days
Last activity: 4849 days
Posted on 05-30-05 05:10 PM Link | Quote
Also don't forget the "Jedi Mind trick"

Palpatine used that a lot on Anakin, especially since he wasn't focused enough to stop it, or aware that was going on because of his attachment to him.

Palpatine did use an odd voice from time to time you know. He just didn't wave his hand each time in classic Alec (Obi-Wan) fashion.

Just a theory, but one that makes sense.
Astrophel
Fear will kill your mind and steal your love as sure as anything;
Fear will rob you blind and make you numb to others suffering









Since: 10-03-04
From: Azul Lux Orbital, Kirin Beta

Since last post: 1074 days
Last activity: 422 days
Posted on 05-30-05 06:30 PM Link | Quote
Originally posted by The Emperor
He tells the story about his Master, Darth Plagues and hints at the fact that he killed him in his sleep.

Now, maybe I wasn't paying enough attention (probably; my cousin was talking a lot), but the way he said it, it sounded like he was talking about an "old Sith legend" - to use the words I remember him using. But, again, maybe I wasn't paying enough attention.
Shinobi

Koopa








Since: 10-24-04
From: Kansas

Since last post: 5598 days
Last activity: 5215 days
Posted on 05-30-05 08:46 PM Link | Quote
Originally posted by Truth/Serum
Also don't forget the "Jedi Mind trick"

Palpatine used that a lot on Anakin, especially since he wasn't focused enough to stop it, or aware that was going on because of his attachment to him.

Palpatine did use an odd voice from time to time you know. He just didn't wave his hand each time in classic Alec (Obi-Wan) fashion.

Just a theory, but one that makes sense.


Maybe, but doesn't the Jedi mind trick only work on the weak minded? I don't think Anakian would be tricked that easily. For example in episode VI when Luke goes to Jabba's palce to get Han back. He speaks to Jabba's assassitant and does the mind trick on him but then he tries to do the trick on Jabba, it fails and he falls down into the pit where that monster is at. I just think Anakian was blinded by his feelings for Palpatine.
Truth/Serum

Cheep-cheep
Continued Harassment.








Since: 03-07-05
From: In pieces

Since last post: 4878 days
Last activity: 4849 days
Posted on 05-30-05 09:59 PM Link | Quote
Well, not weak minded, but unsuspecting.

Jabba knew it was coming, anakin didn't expect it, and you could see the struggle between him and palpatines voice and all.

And all his canned responses to him were a bit structured, and not said with any real ammount of emotion behind them, almost blind acceptance.

Just what I think anyhow. And you could hear palpatine pulling some weird things out with his voice.
Ϡ
This isn't about you and your loud mouth,
This is about me and my fucking beard.








Since: 08-29-04
From: PA

Since last post: 3442 days
Last activity: 3066 days
Posted on 05-31-05 06:54 PM Link | Quote
The Emporer's voice wasn't manipulating Anakin. His words were. Anakin believed the Emporer's talk of preserving life and love etched his judgement. Durr. His vioce was just another characteristic of the actor. Whoo.
Xeoman

Ball and Chain Trooper
Administrator








Since: 08-14-04
From: 255

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 7 days
Posted on 06-01-05 04:47 PM Link | Quote
Originally posted by Jedi Watchman Tamarin
Originally posted by The Emperor
He tells the story about his Master, Darth Plagues and hints at the fact that he killed him in his sleep.

Now, maybe I wasn't paying enough attention (probably; my cousin was talking a lot), but the way he said it, it sounded like he was talking about an "old Sith legend" - to use the words I remember him using. But, again, maybe I wasn't paying enough attention.


There's a book on it, about Plagues and Palpatine.

Remember, this is Palpatine we're talking, so he's probably just passing on lies to Anakin.

But after seeing it 5 times, I'm sure there's a big hint in there that Palpatine did kill Plagues, whom was his Master.

I've heard theories that Palpatine is way older than what he really is (like he's been around for hundreds of years), but I'm not so sure about that.
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